Ep. 01 | How A Star is Born - Collin Morikawa & Rick Sessinghaus

Collin Morikawa and Rick Sessinghaus are joining us for this first episode. Whether you are a junior golfer, beginner or a scratch handicap, you can learn from the processes that Collin and Rick have followed for many years to succeed at the highest level.

Upon his debut in 2019, Collin is one of the most exciting young players on the PGA TOUR. Rick is a performance coach and mental trainer and has worked with Collin since he was 8 years old.

Just a year ago from today, Collin was playing college golf at the University of California, Berkeley, and was one of the most renowned amateur golfers. After graduating from college in May 2019, he won his first PGA TOUR event in July. Rick not only works with Collin, but with many other high-performance individuals, CEOs, executives, and business owners.

In this episode, we discuss…

• Handling adversity on the course

• The timeline, path, and strategy of Collin’s development

• Collin’s edge around everyone else

• Bouncing back from bogeys with consecutive birdies

• The preparation from college to professional golf

• Training the right mindset

• How to have qualitative practice sessions

• Parental support

Connect

Collin’s Instagram: @collinmorikawa
Collin’s Twitter: @collin_morikawa

Rick’s Instagram: @ricksessinghaus
Rick’s Twitter: @ricksessinghaus

Mac’s Instagram: @mactoddlife
Leo’s Instagram: @leo_ugp

TRANSCRIPT

Leo
Welcome to The Urban Golf Podcast. This is the first episode, and it's a good one. It's really exciting. We're having Collin Morikawa and his coach Rick Sessinghaus on. And I mean, what can you say? The guy's already a star. We had the privilege to start working with him about a year and a half ago, and Collin has not missed a single cut as a professional, has made every cut on the PGA Tour, and I think he won the 7th PGA tournament he played in.

Mac
Yeah, I think, what is he 18 for 18 or something like that?

Leo
Yeah, might be more.

Mac
Yeah, and one of the things that I love from the episode so much is, he's not scared of anybody. His best game, and that you could see it from when he plays out there and you ask any of his peers out there on the PGA Tour. His best game is as good as anybody else. So there's to the upside for calling this tremendous. Rick is awesome. It is so rare to have a coach from when you're eight years old, until you're winning on the PGA Tour, winning in college, winning the Walker Cup. I mean, Rick has been there the entire way. So to hear, to get that perspective from a player and coach, from junior days to the highest level, it's so awesome. And Rick obviously being such a big part of our community and helping us with mental coaching with the rest of our team, it's just awesome stuff.

Leo
Yeah, such a fascinating conversation, because I think it relates to and can be beneficial for a young junior golfer to listen to, to an up-and-coming professional, to a parent, a coach, because what they've done since Collin was eight years old is close to textbook. The way they prepared for him to go to the different phases of his career, from playing college golf at Cal, one of the best amateur careers in history, to then go onto the PGA Tour. It was all seamless because of how much planning that went in and how much long term development planning that went into how they were going to go about it. And even for amateur golfers listening, a lot of what Collin is talking about can be applied by you. A lot of the habits and routines and the mindset can actually be applied for beginners. So I think it's a really interesting perspective that way.

Mac
Yeah, I thought one of my favorite themes of it and it's pervasive throughout the episode is the concept of competition, and how much competition and developing your maturity in competition. And Rick gets into talking about participation trophies essentially, how losing, wanting to win, and failure, and how important that is to develop your maturity as a competitor. I think that applies across all facets of life. It's a great episode. Can't wait to share it with you all. So enjoy.

Leo
Our plan with this conversation is to go back and talk about your relationship and how it started. But I need to hear from you, how it was to, I think you were Top 10 after the first round of The Players, right? You shot three or four under?

Collin
Yeah, four under I think.

Leo
What happened? How was that whole experience? I'm sure it's really bizarre.

Collin
I mean, it was crazy because you hear the NBA have their sanctions and everyone stopping there and then, we're wondering for even gonna play Thursday. You see guys tee off, then you're still thinking about that, but you don't even know what's going on. We're the one tour that still has plans to keep playing, and then you realize, you have to tee off on Thursday and you gotta forget everything else, we gotta worry about just playing golf. Had one of my best strokes gained putting days of the entire year, which is kind of awesome to have especially, we had been working on that for quite a while. And then, you finish the round, everything's fine. I stayed up pretty late that night because I had, I didn't stay up too late but you know, I was just watching TV or whatever. Then you get a text message saying everything's cancelled and you take a few seconds, I took a few seconds and it was kind of surreal because you didn't realize everything that was going on. We didn't know how bad it was gonna be. My girlfriend and I, we've known about the virus, obviously, through China and everything. We've been cautious since even Phoenix, when the first few cases in the U. S. had popped up. So it's not like everything was gonna be just crazy. But in a day it seemed like everyone went from being perfectly OK to full panic. You head into the locker room on Friday trying to pick up all your clubs, clean out your locker room, and guys, they're just, we don't know what to do. It's trying to find flights home, trying to get home as quickly as you can. So, it was crazy in that sense of just trying to figure out what we're gonna do now, and when this will be over.

Leo
Yeah. I'm interested in, how's your conversation between you and Collin, Rick? Like after something like that happens? Because one of the things that I'm so impressed with is just the way Collin handles adversity. So what's that conversation after that? The disappointment obviously, you're in contention in the fifth major and then just gets cancelled.

Rick
Sure. Well, we actually had dinner that night after his first round, and I think there was part of our typical conversation after a round, which is, what did you do well? And what did you learn? And what are some things that need to be maybe adjusted for? Now he played quite well from from tee to green and obviously putted really well, so we're in a very optimistic state of mind. And yet, even at that dinner, there's still a lot of unknown, because literally in the back is a TV that has, I don't know who was it at that time, there was another news thing going on. I mean, we didn't definitely talk about it, but you kind of go, you don't know what's gonna happen the next day. And I think my only concern for him what was hey, can you get home safely first, and he did. Then I think unfortunately, it's all the unknown. So at first you're like, okay, you're in Vegas. So you go playing some golf and then you're like, is that the best thing to do right now? So I think Collin's always had to be able to take something in without over emotionalizing it, if that's a word. And be able to step back and say, OK, what needs to happen from that? I think, yeah, there's part disappointment, all the prep work that went into that week, and everything that's gone up into it. Certainly there's disappointment, and I don't want to speak for Collin, but I think a perspective shift happens. I was just thankful that they got back safe, I got back safe the next day, so we go from there.

Leo
Collin or Rick, you talk about panic. They went from hey, we're gonna play this event, to we're gonna go through this event, to we're gonna play with no fans, to everyone get the hell out of here. What was the general sentiment of the players and were people like, OK, cool let's just get out of here or people like, we gotta get out of here. What was the sense of energy there?

Collin
I think with a lot of like European players, they were starting to worry about where they were going to go after The Players, what they were gonna do, what their families were going to do. So people living in the States, I think were fine. But it was more worried about other tournaments, like the Masters that was gonna happen. And how are people gonna get back, even if there's no fans? How are these players gonna get in? How is everyone else gonna get to their home, their families? So a lot of people in the U. S. I think it was a lot easier for them because they could either fly really quickly, drive wherever they live, and get out. But when you think about everyone else, golf is a worldwide tour, it's not just based in the U. S., people are from everywhere. The best players are from all around the world, and you have to think about what everyone else is gonna be going through. And for Friday's round, I was like, Friday through Sunday, why not just play with no fans?, There is nothing gonna be wrong with that. But if you think about it in the long run, people are gonna be missing flights. You don't know how they're going to get home. It is just so much more than just playing three more days, and I know the PGA Tour wanted to get the players in because it's their tournament. It's our tournament. It's for us. It was definitely a little disappointing at the end, not being able to play. But overall, I think it was a great decision for them to stop everything. And now it was, we were going to go play Zurich, we were going to go to New Orleans for all that. Then things just, domino affect, one after another. It just kept going and going. And I assume, more events will keep happening like that.

Leo
It's unprecedented times for pretty much any of us and definitely the sports world. So what I love when I talk to you guys about how it all started, when you were growing up and you start working with Rick. Rick always talked about how you did everything in four year stints. Like long term development. Can you talk a little bit about that? Because I think that's important, not just for competitive juniors, it's also important for amateur golfers to understand that. If you have really short term goals and you only care about that, you're only going to go so far. And that's very rare, especially in junior golf now, to have that mindset. Where where am I gonna be in four years? Where did that start?

Rick
I think using Collin's timeline is gonna be beneficial for everybody, but especially the juniors out there. I meet Collin when he's eight years old. Us that have been junior golfers, I started when I was 12 years old playing the game, but we know there's some distinct not only physical things that happen from the age of 8 to 18 but emotionally and psychologically. I think we need to look at some of that grouping. So you meet an eight year old who already had some great fundamentals from a technical standpoint, good group lessons. He was already a hard worker, but I know through him learning how to compete, then when he gets older and he goes through puberty, and there's a lot of just regular development that goes on. I think that's lost in juniors for sure. So when I was chunking it with him, it's more of okay, I have somebody who's talented, great. He wants to play tournaments, that's different than having to play tournaments, and we're lucky that we do have US kids, we have SCPGA, we have Future Champions, we have AJGA. We have already a development that you could start with at that age. And being able to have his dad caddy or his uncle caddy. And that helps that process. I think just from my standpoint, I never stressed, did you win your US kids tournament or not? I think at an early age, with certainly his dad, who went to every single lesson, it was more about hey, what'd you learn? What'd you like about that? Oh, I got to play this course. I wanted to make sure that he was doing it for the right reasons all the time, because sometimes as we get older, especially closer to college recruiting time, I have seen a lot of juniors started doing it for, I don't wanna say the wrong reasons, just now different reasons that may not be as intrinsically motivated, right? It's now, my parents are still making me play and making me do this and making me do that. That never came across with Collin. He wanted to do those things. So I think when I was looking at the chunking, I was looking at, okay, we have US Kids time, which is about 8 to 12 years old, and then you have SCPGA, and then you have AJGA. I looked at from a competitive standpoint, I knew he was gonna go up this ladder. Now, to get to those different ladders, he's gonna have to improve certain skill sets along the way. And I think about the age of 15, 16 was interesting with his golf swing, were a lot of juniors because they're not as strong in their core, will come under plane a little bit more as they lose their spine tilt, come under, flip it over, and draw the ball. And I'm trying to manage that. I'm not trying to say hey, you gotta hit it straighter. I'm trying to manage that we don't get into snap hooks type. But then he gets bigger and stronger, and then we see it kind of flip the other way, where we have a more neutral swing plane, always controls his club face quite well. And now it became more of okay Collin, what is the ball flight you want to have, what looks good to you? And that developed into the fade. I'm not one who says you have to have one over the other by any means. But for him, it started to evolve into that fade. Now all golf swing lessons is with that model, of what is going to support this baby fade start positions and all that kind of stuff. I wasn't a model swing per se, but wanted him to understand the causes and effect of when he was 15 and he's under plane, flipping it over. And now as we evolved, that there was certainly swing mechanics. But physically, I don't think would have been able to hit a fade real well when he was 15. I don't think he was strong enough in his core and certain things to do that. So I'm looking at it now from a physical development. Can you actually do the things I want him to do. I knew he couldn't do it at 12, 13, 14. But then, as we evolved, he became, what I call a neutral swing plane because I wanted him to be able to hit it either way and also change trajectories. I knew that was gonna come a little bit later. Again, not gonna come when you're 12 years old. So that's in my head. I'm very fortunate that I have somebody who is a hard worker, who wants to learn, who is also patient. Him and his dad are patient with the process and they trusted me with that which I'm very grateful for.

Leo
So then Collin, did you ever feel when you were 13 or 14, did you ever feel the pressure from your friends or anything like, oh, I gotta play well next week in the AJGA or you never felt that type of social pressure?

Collin
Not really. I mean, obviously you have your friends on the golf course and growing up where I played my 10-hole country club in Glendale, Chevy Chase Country Club, I was the only one playing there. I played with a few other guys that were like 5, 6 years older than me. But we were just having fun on the golf course. It's not like I had a lot of guys my age to practice with, to play against. All my friends in high school, junior high school, elementary school, they didn't play golf so they knew I was good at it, but they didn't know to what extent. They just knew if I was going to go play a tournament, it was a tournament. So on that end, I didn't have to worry about what they thought, what they expected, if I came back winning. For them it was just OK, you're going to go play a golf tournament, and that's pretty cool. But when I was 13, 14, that's when you get into Toyota Tour Cups or you get into AJGAs, and that's when it all started. But I always believed that I could go compete with these guys. It's crazy, when I was younger,, I think I only saw Beau Hossler maybe a couple times in either an AJGA or a Toyota Tour Cup. And he was the man to beat in Southern California. The guy won everything, and then as I saw him in college in my freshman year,  then it's like, OK, we can compete with these guys. But in junior golf, yeah, I think I had to have that same mindset is that whoever these guys were, I had to have that mindset, that I could go play with them. I could be them. Even if I knew that they were better than me, I didn't admit that to myself. I just thought I could go out there and win. No matter where we were, no matter what tournament I was put in, I thought I could go out and win.

Leo
It was really interesting, we talked of James Oh yesterday and he had just an incredible junior career. Qualified for the US Am at 14, won the World Champion Junior Worlds in '98, was the youngest winner on the Nationwide Tour at 21. He was basically talking about how all of this junior career, he was just following the process. Then when he went pro and after his win, he started searching. He has two different segments of his career. Junior career, one of the most successful ever and then he started to search to improve, instead of being okay with poor outcomes but just following the process, I thought that was so interesting to see the parallels there because you guys have just followed the process for a long time, and sometimes it's better to follow a process, even if it's the wrong thing to do. Sometimes maybe you don't have the right coach, or not everything the coach teaches you is good. If you follow that process, it might be better than switching around and start searching. Do you believe that, Rick?

Rick
Well definitely, again I'm biased because I think as a coach, you're trying to create a plan and a process for every student that you come across. Now each student has different motivations, different time commitments, different things they can and cannot do. But I know what UGP does so quite well, is you're assessing somebody in all these different areas. One of them is, what do you want? And hey, let's create a plan to get there. With Collin, we never really talked about a ton of long term goals. Even though I knew he loved the game. I'm treating him as somebody who, let's say he's 12 years old that wants to play high level Division I, and thinking about what that is going to take. So that process, and Collin and I are always forthright with each other, where if I don't have an answer, I'm going to seek out the experts like you, Leo. I'm gonna seek out somebody who is an expert in physical training. I know he needs a certain area, let's say his left hip is is a little tight, a little weak, and he slides into it. I need that help, and I'm not sure if a lot of the other coaches, we have big egos right, is they're able to create a team around that, and that's I've always told Collin is that with the process, you still have to look at results. If the results are not what you thought the process would get, you do have to make adjustments. And sometimes I need help to see where that could be coming from. I do believe in a process, but I think you do have to always get feedback immediately to see what is actually transpiring with the performance.

Leo
Yeah, especially when you look at the greats Arnie, Jack, they all had pretty much the same coach their whole career. I guess you can argue that, Tiger, maybe would have been better off if he stayed with Bush or whatever, I mean is just speculation. But that's why I think what you guys are doing and you're following it so well, which I think rare, unfortunately.

Mac
So how did you guys manage? What are your thoughts on going through the different levels. You talked, Collin, earlier about how you were sizing up the next level of competition as you were going through your career, going from Toyota Tour Cup to then winning these AJGAs, to then going to college golf and high level amateur, to professional. Talk about that progression of sizing up competition and then chasing the next level. And how to keep perspective there.

Collin
Yeah well, I will actually never won an AJGA. Unfortunately, that's one thing I wish I could go back. Oh,
my God. I wish I could go back and go compete again.

Mac
I think you're doing alright.

Collin
Maybe I'd win one now. But yeah, like I said, there's a path that a lot of junior tours lead up to, right? And the AJGA is one path that brings college awareness, college coaches to come and see you. A ton of juniors now, the programs and the tournaments they have are such an opportunity. But you gotta start somewhere, whether you start really early in your your local tours. I started US Kids, I started SCPGA, and then you move up from there, then you see Toyota Tour Cup, and then you have that AJGA. You know each level is better and better. It goes from a local area to more of a national area. Then you're playing against guys from around the world, that might go to some academy in Florida. And now you're competing against guys you see every single tournament you play for the AJGA, and that's where I built a lot of my friends. But if you think about you know, mentally, where you got to stack yourself up, I think a lot of people don't really believe that they can do it. They see someone that has played well in the tournament or might have won a tournament, and then they sit back and they're like, wow, I want to be like them, not I want to be myself, and I want to go play my own game and make a name for myself.  I want to go do what they're doing and I think that's when you go back and and look at coaches and how we're doing it. Rick and I are always trying to figure it out ourselves. We can't figure it out. We get input from other people, but we keep all our knowledge limited so much to where we want to know everything. But there comes a point where there's too much information. So when you're feeding yourself that much information for wanting to know all these levels and going from the junior tours to the AJGA to college golf, there's more and more people involved. You hear a lot more things from other people, whether it's your coaches, friends, teammates, whatever it is. And that's when things get a little buzzed up in your head and you don't know what path to take. For us, it was pretty set out. We knew we wanted to do SCPGA. That's what I started with. And then we went to Toyota Tour Cup. I didn't play that many years on Toyota Tour Cup, maybe one, maybe two years, one and a half, and then it was a quick transition to AJGA, and that's when we started going from Junior All Star tournaments to open tournaments to invitationals. Now we're making the Wyndham Cup teams and all this stuff. And it was just a sense that I believed I could do it. There is no doubt in my mind that I could do it, even though my game might have not been as good as the top juniors at a certain part of the transition from junior golf, to AJGA, and then to college golf. But I still believed that my game could be as good. As any one of those guys.

Leo
Did you actually, at 16 years old, did you truly 100% believe that you were gonna play on the PGA TOUR?

Collin
Yeah, and I believed that since I was 10. Once I stopped playing other sports and I fully focused on golf I thought, PGA Tour is my only path. There is no other way of going around it. You asked me what I wanted to do. It was, become a professional golfer on the PGA Tour and become number one in the world. And win a bunch of PGA TOUR tournaments, majors, all that stuff that comes along with that. I never thought about anything else. It was only that drive, that passion that I wanted to go fulfill and people are like always have a plan B. All this stuff to me, school is always important. It's not about having a plan B of, this could be helpful along the road. For me it was, I can go to school to help further my golf game. I can go get my business degree, which I did to help my career not just on the golf course, but off the golf course. It was all a plan to just help build my golf career. It's nice to have it as a backup, you can look at it from many different perspectives. But for me, it was PGA TOUR or nothing. It was always going to be the PGA TOUR.

Mac
So you talk about how you had a process and a system and a plan, the whole way. And you guys are constantly seeking knowledge but not necessarily searching. So maybe Rick, talk a little bit about the difference between seeking knowledge and getting information from others and going through those levels while not getting lost.

Rick
Very, very difficult, right? I'm a very curious guy to begin with even outside of golf, because I just want to help my own self, right? So what I'm looking at is, there's performance factors, right? We shoot 20 rounds of golf in a tournament, we have, we have a pattern, right? So I think it's important to now dissect the pattern to say, hey, why is somebody averaging 74.5? And most people just say in our day and age unfortunately, a lot of it is, oh, their golf swings or something like that. I'm going, maybe. Okay, what's the ball flight doing? But if I miss fairways, does that really mean it was a swing issue? It could have been a strategy issue. You could be taking the wrong line. It could be unbiased to the mental game. They may have not been committed the shot in the first place, and you feel tension, and you blocked it to the right. So I'm trying to really figure out the true constant effect. I try to ask as many questions as possible, and throughout the years when we do a debrief, I'm asking Collin a ton of questions. I'm trying to find what his patterns are. Now, if I don't think immediately, oh, I don't know what that pattern is, I may seek things out. I may ask colleagues, I may, Leo, ask you about physical stuff of, hey, I got Collin sliding a little into that left hip. Can you help me? So I'm open to that. But I think I have to do a good enough job of breaking down the pattern to understand what the true cause and effect is. So that's how I filter all the information. Because there's tons of information out there, I go, that's not relevant. That's not relevant. By me having a set of questions that is related to Collin. Now another student, I have a different set of questions because of where they're at.

Leo
Collin, what's your view when you look back at your junior career, amateur career, and then now pro, I can't even remember anybody coming out on tour the way you have, which makes you very special. What do you believe is your edge against everyone else? Coming out as a rookie, and still you haven't missed a cut. That doesn't happen very often in this sport.

Collin
I think obviously being with Rick has helped a lot from a very young age. He's been able to work the mental game into our lessons and to our practice, being very efficient with what we do. It's not just a waste of time to be out there, I was never someone that's just going to sit out there and beat a bunch of balls on the range. It was always having a purpose. I probably should have practiced a little more on my short game when I was younger and just kept hitting putts. But when I look back at what we did, I think he always incorporated something mentally. Or, he made me think about what I was doing or why. Why I was doing it this way. As a little kid, you're just gonna listen and keep doing whatever your coach says. I remember one lesson we had, it was on the 9th hole at Scholl Canyon. I kept hitting my 8 iron or a pitching wedge. And I hit it like three times. My dad and Rick are looking at each other so weird, and I missed the green all three times. I think it was short right. And they were like what are you doing? Like, I'm just trying to hit it harder. Well, you gotta change. You gotta adapt. You have to do something different. And that really stuck with me because for me, we use the word creative. I like to use that word a lot. I've gotta stay creative on the course. I've gotta stay creative when I practice. When I was a junior, we didn't talk about these words or certain words, pre shot routine and all that stuff. It was more about just me being efficient and creative with what I was doing. Rick was always able to incorporate something on the mental side, that I was just not aware of. And it just made me think like a different person. I think going back to your question of what allowed me to come out this quickly, is that I think I was just mentally prepared way more than a lot of guys do when they come out of college. I think I had a lot of things prepped for me. I had a lot of things laid out. So when I did turn pro, I knew what I was going to do. I really used that senior year to know what I was going to do on the practice range on those Monday through Wednesday days. Figure out how I was going to use my time wisely, and there's so much more than just going out there and playing on a Thursday through Sunday. There's so much prep. There's so much work that's involved. And I think I had all the marbles lined up and ready just so I could go out on Thursday and just play golf.

Mac
One of the things, Collin, I've seen is with the way that you play out there, is how much joy you play with, and it just seems like you're having a lot of fun. You're smiling. I think a lot of us, Jack Nicklaus and Tiger Woods being very serious and in their own bubble was how when we were growing up, watching all those guys and being like, I gotta be in my own bubble, I gotta be really serious. And looks to me like you just have a lot of fun out there and then when it's time for you to hit your shot, you zone right in and you can even see it. So can you talk a little about that? Are you having fun out there? How does that work for you?

Collin
Yeah I mean, how could I not have fun? Traveling everywhere, playing these amazing courses and I love every part of it. It's not just playing on these beautiful courses Monday through Sunday. It's meeting a bunch of people meeting these guys that I've watched growing up. Obviously Tiger, and you see Rory and DJ. And I'm getting a lot closer with these guys just getting to know them off the course. But when you think about it, it was so much fun being able to fulfill something I've thought about my entire life, right? I've always wanted to be a professional golfer. I've always wanted to be on the PGA TOUR, and to finally be here, you have to enjoy it. What Rick and I have always worked on is, we're out there for five hours, right? Four and a half, five hours. And then you have those college days when you're out there for 10 plus hours, right? I can't focus just simply on golf for 10 plus hours out there, I think it's physically and mentally impossible. You will be drained. And I think what we've done a really good job is when we do, when we're ready to hit our shot, we step into another zone. We get into that Tiger zone. We get into that Jack zone of complete focus. And you have to enjoy it when you're walking. You have to think of other things. Think of good, positive thoughts, whatever it is. But you have to know when to change, when to step in to that different balance of being focused for the shot or not focused. I know there's days that I've had in 36 hole days in college, where you come to the end and you're a little mentally fatigued, you know? But you just have to grind. You have to get through it. Especially when you're playing in tough conditions like Bay Hill a few weeks ago, nothing was easy. You had to focus every single shot. But when you hit that shot and you're onto the next shot, in between that walking period, you just have to free your mind. Think about something else. And I think that helped me and make me maybe enjoy it a lot more.

Leo
I think what's interesting when we follow you, very closely, obviously we're invested in you.

Mac
Definitely the Collin Morikawa fan club over here.

Collin
Well first, I hate that I've made that many bogeys. That's never good. Especially this 2020 year, I've made more mistakes that I really shouldn't have. Put myself in certain spots that I've been able to learn. So, you go back to those Thursday, Friday rounds where I might be a couple over through five holes and Rick and I, we've always worked on starting off very strong, being ready on that first hole to make a birdie. And it's weird because I've looked at my college career. I've looked at now my PGA TOUR career, a professional career, and it's different rounds. I've been starting off good. I've been starting off bad. I've had really good Friday rounds in the PGA TOUR so far, my Sunday rounds haven't been great, my Thursday rounds haven't been fantastic. In college, my final round, my third round scores were off the charts. They were fantastic. So it's looking at certain rounds, and it changes. It keeps changing like this, but I think with all these bogeys and then with all these birdies, what I know is that there's always birdie opportunities, no matter where you are. And I think this is what I did differently in junior golf. I would go through the course in my head to be like, there's really good birdie opportunities on holes, 2, 7, 11, 12, 13, 17, and I'd be like, I have to make birdies on these holes. When I went to college, it was like, let's try and birdie every single hole. If I don't make birdie, whatever, let's go on to the next. Try and get out with par. Obviously there's holes that are par holes and you have to just take your medicine, get out. Sometimes it's bogey, wherever you get your tee shot. maybe. But with professional golf now, and you look at these Thursday, Friday rounds, obviously you're trying to make the cut. But I've changed that mindset of just trying to make the cut, to trying to win. I tried to make the cut at the US Open. I tried to make the cut in Canada. That's when you find yourself a lot closer to the cut line. And for me, it's just let's go out and make a bunch of birdies. My caddie JJ is awesome because he's like, even if I start off bad, if I make a few bogeys in the row, let's go, keep giving ourselves these birdie opportunities. I'm a good enough ball striker off the tee into greens, where I'm gonna be having birdie chances. I just gotta keep doing that. If I get too down on myself, that's when bogeys, and bogeys, and bad numbers will keep piling up and I won't give myself those chances.

Mac
So Rick, talk a little bit about preparation? Going from college golf to traveling and playing professional golf. What were those conversations like and how did you guys prepare for the change in travel, and being away from home, and everything like that? Or was that something you guys already prepared for?

Rick
Well, until you're there, I don't think you know all the details. I think fortunately for Collin with the last couple of years especially, he's playing a pretty good schedule for Cal. He plays Walker Cup. He's playing Palmer Cup twice. He's playing the World Amateur. One of Palmer Cups is in France. So he does get, I mean, I know it's not three weeks in a row, but he's traveling a lot to the East Coast. He's doing transmits. I think he was fortunate with this success to start to learn some of the ups and downs of just travel, time zones, we talk about sleep a lot. We talk about something that I think we both made mistakes with at the start, was maybe over preparing at some of the events and how do we now recover a little bit more throughout the week? So I've certainly made mistakes along the way and I think again what's been great is that we can always learn from experience and he had a ton in those last couple of years that it was now international. So I think that's part of it. And I think getting Collin's feedback of some of the mistakes we made at previous events is to say, hey, okay, let's map out when you're actually going to get there. Instead of doing 18 hole practice rounds, just do nine holes. Week to week may change a little bit, but I think he's finding a good rhythm right now. With that now, we haven't gone through all the majors yet. There's gonna be some shifts going on, and we just talked yesterday about the potential schedule this year. I know there's a lot of unknowns, but theoretically, you could play like seven out of eight weeks just because of how they're going to condense, potentially, the schedule. So we have to adjust to that. But back to the original question, I think we always were learning throughout his college career. Fortunately, he had a lot of other great events to go to. And I would always ask for feedback that had sometimes nothing to do with how he played. But how was the travel, how was the sleep? Those type of things along the way.

Leo
Collin, when you when you were 10 years old and you believed that you would be on the PGA TOUR, Do you feel like Rick helped you believe stronger or do you feel like it was completely innate?

Collin
I think it started with me. And if I don't believe it, then it will never happen, you know? I think I fully believed that. I think Rick was a very, very big piece in me getting there. We've talked about so much. We have learned so much about each other. He knows me. He knows everything about my golf game and that's what you want. You don't want to go to someone and have them to try and figure it out and take a while. We knew what to work on. We knew things, and that's it. That's what makes Rick great is that we weren't trying to change a bunch. And it's not like we were trying to do all this, certain feels or whatever with the swing, or trying to get myself in a certain position. Like you said, it was more about producing a good golf game. What was gonna produce a good shot? If this was working, then let's make it work. You know, we have this crazy almost stack and tilt swing thought. It just happened for me that week when I won the Western Junior, and that was my first national win in 2013. So for me, I think it always started in myself. I think if it comes from other people, even if it's from your parents, that they can believe, and they tell you. It's very nice. And I've been very lucky to have very supportive parents that believe in me. With what I've been doing, they've helped me so much. I can't thank him enough. But always had to start with me. If I didn't really believe that I could do this, it was never going to succeed from the very beginning.

Leo
I think it's an interesting topic because it seems like and can also be trained in some ways. Like you can train yourself to actually start to believe, because it's clear that if you don't believe that you're gonna be able to hit the fairway, you're less likely to hit the fairway. And belief is such a broad, vague statement. But actually, when you look at it in detail, it's really interesting how to develop it because it's probably the most important thing in sports to absolutely, truly, genuinely believe that you can do it. Because there's so many 10 year olds that, yeah, I was gonna be on the PGA Tour. Rick, how did you actually develop that? Was it positive reinforcement? Like, oh, you can do it, you're good enough. How do you train it?

Rick
We'll talk about with Collin first, then I'll talk about how I do it with other students because there is a distinct difference. Collin already did have that belief in him and we now know about what we call growth mindset, right? Great book by Carol Dweck. Collin has always had a growth mindset towards mastery, is that if I'm not good enough, I can get better. Well, other people they go, oh, I'm not good enough, I guess this is just how I'm gonna be. And so I cultivated the growth mindset because we were always about learning, it wasn't about being critical like, that was a bad round of golf how the hell did you not break 80? I don't know if we ever talked about score much as a junior, and I could be wrong, but it was more of okay, he's the one playing. I need his feedback of what he felt he did well, and what you can learn. So from Collin's perspective, I was cultivating a great mindset already. I'm not gonna take credit for his great innate motivation and his mindset, I definitely wasn't gonna be breaking it. I grew up in a household where my dad was really, really tough on me for football, so I knew the critical. If I was always told, you're bad, you're doing that, you gotta do it better, you gotta get it perfect. I knew that didn't work. At least for me. So I was coming from him of cultivating that. Now, why use the growth mindset? I've had people who didn't believe at a certain age, but then when they get into that obstacle, they don't play well in a Toyota Tour Cup or an AJGA. And they think, oh my God, they're so much better. How can I ever get as good as them? That takes now a lot of work on my part as a coach to be able to, like you said Leo, is I believe belief can be trained. If we say where does confidence come from, it comes from results. Obviously. It comes from past results, comes from self talk. It comes from visualizing success. It comes from practice and preparation. It comes from all these elements, but most people are just into what happened yesterday. As a result, I didn't do it yesterday. Uh, I can't do it again. But when you have these different layers of belief and confidence, then you can have a bad round of that tournament, go all right, I got this. Let's go back. And Collin's always had that innate ability to bounce back because he wanted to learn and move on. It wasn't, become a negative belief, oh, crap. I guess I'm not good enough for AJGA because like that. It is a very deep subject, but that's how I go about it.

Collin
I think to add on that, belief has to start within you. I think you can definitely work on that. You could help someone's belief in themselves. But then, on another subject is I don't think you can teach, you know, being competitive and your competitiveness of someone. And I think that's also another edge that I had, because I am so competitive about everything, it doesn't matter. And that's how our lessons always ended with Rick when I was younger, is that we would always have a competition. That is exactly how we would end every single lesson. Me against him. One ball, two balls, whatever it was. Putting, hitting tee shots. Everything. And it's hard to teach someone to be competitive because they could fully believe that they can do it, but then when you put them in a situation like that, are they gonna feel like they can compete? Can they feel like they can win and beat everyone? And if they don't, will they go and work a little harder, go and work again and come back out and try and win again. I think competitiveness is something that is just really within someone. I think it's really hard to teach that to someone.

Rick
I was gonna say along that line because I have seen a shift. I grew up, I'm way older than you guys, but I grew up in a very competitive household. When it comes to sports, it was about winning or losing. It wasn't about learning per se. So it was me playing against my brother and my dad and stuff like that. I think now it's swung on the opposite end, where it's like, okay, if it doesn't work out, it's okay. And I think we're being too touchy, feely with that. It's okay to go out and compete and lose. It's okay. But if we have a learning mindset, then we can go out like Collin says, it's like okay baby, I'm gonna beat Rick next freaking week cause I'm gonna show him. That's what I wanted from somebody. Right now, if I have a 16 year old, I do this all the time in a playing lesson, I'll say, okay, let's compete. Chip shot. Well, that's no fair, you're a pro. I go, oh boy, I've already got a mindset shift. This person doesn't even want to compete. And when they're already forming an excuse for me, I'm going, oh boy, this is not about chipping anymore. This is about taking on that challenge. And he always took on the challenge, and that's what I try to foster as much as I can.

Mac
So on that note of competitiveness, you talk about junior and college golf, you talk about Beau Hossler. Who's your Beau Hossler on the PGA TOUR? Or are you in the league of your own?

Collin
I thought when I was coming out of college and I would say even like at Travelers and the US Open. I would look at all those top 10 players in the world, whether is Rory or Tiger, the guys I've watched growing up forever, and I looked at those guys and I was like, wow, you know, I'm gonna have to be on my A game to beat these guys. And when I was at Travelers and they had all of us Rookies, me, Victor, Matt, Justin Suh sitting down. We had our media conference. Later that day, Brooks had a media conference and I heard him or I read it somewhere that he went from thinking from just making cuts to top 25 to the top tens, top fives, then winning. My mindset just switched in a complete instant, and it went from I can win. I don't care who's in this field. I could go beat these guy. Now that I've gotten to know them a little more and and see their games, it's not like I need to change anything. I think on my best day I can go beat these guys. These guys are freaking good, when they're on their A game too. But I feel like I'm just as good or if not better, when all cylinders are firing. So for me at this point, I don't think there's anyone that I'm afraid to go play with, or afraid to get paired with. I want to be paired with these guys. I like having these big time pairings, these featured groups, because it opens my game up to these guys. I'm able to watch them learn off them. But I don't think there's that person. I think that's when I've hit this mark now where I've won, I feel like I could go win again, and I just continue from there.

Mac
That's awesome, watching you play with Tiger at Torrey and watching how you handled yourself, it is just impressive over and over again. What about practice? You go from college golf to professional golf. Do you have a group you practice with? Do you run your own thing? Are there people that run in clusters? How does that work?

Collin
To be honest, I miss college because we had this great short game area, whatever driving range. But the short game area was amazing. We had rough to chip in. We had my team, a bunch of guys that were good at short game that I could learn off of. Now, I moved to Vegas. I had to find a new group. I knew a bunch of young guys, which is awesome, and I've kind of stuck with them. We're able to play at a bunch of different courses out here in Vegas, which I think is the best as a pro. For anybody that's gonna turn pro, that's listening. You want to find a course that you can play at, but you also want to find guys who can play with. It's the most important thing to stay sharp, stay on edge, whether you're playing for something or not, just to compete with these guys. That's back to that competitive nature. For me, I practice at the Summit. The Discovery Group has been amazing to me, so there's not many guys playing there, but it's my time to figure out what I need for my game. Whether it's putting, chipping, week to week stuff that I need to work on for the next week. That's when I really grind and I figure something out. Then I have a huge group of 8 to 10 guys out here in Vegas that I'm able to play with, and it makes it easier because we can always go find a group, plan a tee time, and go out there and have a nice match.

Leo
From previous conversations with you, Collin, it seems like you have always been focusing on quality practice over a quantitative. Not a huge volume guy in terms of balls hit or anything like that. Is that still the case, or are there parts of your practice that is a little bit more about reps?

Collin
We'll split it up, and we'll talk about the driving range. Driving range, I don't spend a lot of time. And if I do, what I do on the driving range, if I know the course ahead, I'll play the course in my head on the driver range. I'll go driver and then five iron and I have a par three whatever, and that's what I'll do on the driving range. That's the majority of my time.

Leo
Basically not a lot of driving range.

Collin
For me, it's just to make sure everything's in line. If something is not right, I'm not seeing the right thing, I might send something Rick. I might text him, call him, figure something out and normally it's a quick feel, it's a quick change. But with chipping and putting, that's when I think I need more reps. But I also need to be more creative. I'm pretty creative on the driving range, trying to hit a bunch of different shots. I've gotten a lot more creative on the chipping green, but I need to do that on the putting green. I need to see a lot more different shots when I'm chipping, when I'm putting, when I'm doing those things. I've always been someone who likes to play on the golf course, I like to just go play 18 holes, 36 holes, 27 holes, and just go play. But sometimes if I'm hitting a lot of greens, I'm just gonna get a bunch of 25 footers. Sometimes that's not always gonna help me. It's not gonna be beneficial for me when I go out and play in actual tournaments when I put myself in a tough spot. So when I do go practice myself on the chipping green, on the putting green, I'm doing a lot more drills now. But I'm also trying to have a lot more games. I play the course in my head on the driving range and I'm having a game with myself. There's no reward, really. But it's, I'm gonna shoot nine under par because I'm hitting all these great shots. What can I do, and how can I implement games into my putting drills? How can I implement games when I'm chipping? That's what was great about college, is I had a bunch of guys to have chipping competitions with, and that was like 85% of my practice. Which was kind of fun.

Rick
And on that note that I think has helped me as a coach too is his caddie's fantastic. I mean, JJ is awesome. After tournaments, I'll talk to JJ and we'll kind of get his perspective. But what I think both of us have have relied on JJ is he's been on the tour for the last eight years as a caddie, and so he's seen most of these courses. So I'm trying to say how does Collin's game shape to this? And without his knowledge, I don't think the practice rounds would be as efficient. I don't think us going into the Players Championship, yes, Collin had played TPC in the Junior Players, but this is a different. Obviously a different stage here, and to have JJ there say, we may have to have this one area here, this chip shot here on this par five. You may come into here. I love that feedback from JJ because I think it helps Collin prepare better in his practice rounds, but it becomes practice right? Last time it was a lot of chipping at TPC Sawgrass. I want to work on chipping but also, I gotta hit off these different grasses to these different slopes. So I'm learning a lot from JJ also, in this process.

Mac
That's awesome. I got a quick question, Tiger used to talk a lot about how you would peak for majors. So what are your guys'? You make every cut, right? So are you trying to peak for certain major tournaments? Or is it a week to week similar process? Is there a plan for peaking performance, peaking throughout the year? What are your thoughts on that?

Collin
I think your game is gonna be always up and down. You're gonna have really good weeks. You have really bad weeks. And that's when the top guys that have played many years and are literally just trying to win as many majors as they can, that's when they want to peak. They want to time it all right, finally peak at the majors. For me, I'm trying to win every tournament. Doesn't matter what I'm in. I just want to win. So, we're trying to figure it out week by week. What is different from last week that I might have not done something well. And then this week, what am I gonna focus on maybe a fraction more? Just to help me in that sense of whether it's putting or chipping or ball striking. I don't think we talk about peaking, where we're gonna lead up to this? Because that's, you know, goes back to over prepping. I don't want to be on the range couple hours after the round just to figure something out. I feel like by Thursday I have figured everything out. And I think as I do start playing a few more majors, obviously, I played the US Open, and I think we did really well with not doing too much in over prepping. We did just the right amount, what I need. When I start going to these majors and the courses are tougher, it doesn't mean I need over prep and need to do more. I think we do a really good job Monday through Wednesday, figuring out the course, figuring out our game, plan our strategy, how we're gonna attack certain holes, and you know it doesn't need to change. I think a lot of pros have had successes and they've won majors by doing something a little different for the majors. I haven't had enough reps in for majors to really figure out what works and what doesn't. So for me, screw it. It's another tournament. Just has a bigger title, a nicer purse, a bigger trophy, whatever it is. But for me, it's another tournament. What makes it so different? And I think that's the mindset I need to keep going for a long time into my career, is that these are just another tournament with the same guys. I've been fortunate enough to play in a lot of strong field events. Now that I've seen all these guys, it's not like I'm going from, you know, it goes back to those junior days where I went from Toyota Tour Cup, which is very local, to Junior All Stars, which is a certain age group. Now I'm playing opens and invitationals where everyone is there. I've already had my reps in all these in the short time span of time WGC, playing in Asia, where there's limited field events where the best players are playing, and I've seen all these guys. So it makes it the exact same when I go to these majors. These are the same guys I've seen at the Players, in Asia, at the US Open. I've played with all of them, I know who they are. it's just another event. Everyone's out, they're a little more focused. But for me, I'm the same amount of focused as I was playing Barracuda or my first event in Canada.

Leo
I have a question that goes back to your childhood, because you always impressed me so much when you come and we train, and you have this attitude that you're very present when you communicate, just kind of rare today. Then you also have this extreme gratitude. You're just a nice guy, and you can tell that you truly care about others. But then you also have that, what was that quote about Seve Ballesteros?

Mac
You look them in the eye and you bury them.

Leo
Yeah, you look nice on the outside and they are nice, but inside, I wanna bury you. Where did that come from? Because that is a very rare combination. How did your dad raise you and coach you?

Collin
Well, you know, it wasn't really coaching. Rick was my coach. My dad wasn't the one following me out to practice. I'd go out when I was 11, 12, 13, and we'd start asking them, Chevy Chase Country Club, to give me a cart so I could just go practice more and I wouldn't have to walk up a hill just to go pick up balls. It was more just having my dad and my mom be the most supportive parents I could have asked for. It goes back to how competitive was I. Competitiveness. You can't just hand it out like it's money, where if I give you this competitiveness, you're going to be competitive. That was always a me, but my parents raised me to obviously be a very good person, to respect others. To respect people the way you want to be treated. My parents aren't overly wanting the spotlight. They're people that stay within themselves. They mind their own business. They like to, and I think I've become similar to who they are is, I'm just standing there. I want to be within everyone. I want to be in the crowd. I want to be with it, what everyone else is doing. But I just want to listen. I just want to figure out what everyone else is doing here. Everyone's opinion. If I'm really believing in something, I'll speak my mind. When my dad would go to a bunch of junior tournaments, a bunch of kids loved my dad, loved talking to him because he was just a person that they can go and talk to and talk about anything. Say hi, have a good time. Not when I'm chipping or hitting balls my dad was right there behind me, grilling me for doing something.

Leo
Yeah. So it was never really about the performance. Never talking too much about the performance, not happy with you or this and that. It was mostly just supportive, helping you out there.

Collin
Yeah. I mean there was obviously disappointments on the way. If I kept doing something that was just, all kids think we know everything, I still think I know everything and I know I don't. But, when I would do something like that or have some really bad rounds that just didn't make sense, because he knew I was a smart kid. He knew I was able to learn. But sometimes as a kid, I just wouldn't think of all these things. And I wouldn't process what we would do during practice. There's obviously going to be disappointment. And it's not like he was, just like Rick said, oh, it's okay, everything is going to be perfectly fine, you're gonna be okay. There would be some grillings and some harshness. But that's all part of it. But it's not like it was non stop, 24/7 of you gotta do this, come on keep doing this. You're going to do this until you figure it out. He wanted me to figure it out, and that's when he would get down on me, is when I wouldn't figure it out myself and it really wasn't working. Sometimes things are hard to process in your mind. You just can't figure it out. But he knows it was probably something I already learned with Rick or with them on the course, it was just something I forgot and I just didn't keep in my head. So it wasn't a relationship of, there you go, you're on a pedestal. Everything is gonna be perfectly fine. But when things went bad, he was still very supportive. My parents were very supportive in what I was doing. They gave their full 100% effort to make sure I had everything I needed. Obviously all started with Rick, and then reaching out to other things, giving myself the opportunity to play in all these tournaments week in and week out.

Mac
Awesome. It's all been so informative. And it's great to see how you guys' relationship has progressed to where it is today. It's probably a dream come true for both you. To see Collin, grown man out there, winning on tour, and just where you guys have come from. I appreciate you guys taking this time, and I got one last question that I'd want to ask so we can let Collin get back to this PlayStation. Collin, tell us a little bit about what you're going to be doing with this indefinite time off. How are you gonna stay sharp? I've read a lot about how in the NBA they're dropping gyms off at these guys' houses and doing whatever they can to keep them training. So what are you up to?

Collin
Well, my house in Vegas does not have space to put in indoor basketball court or even a small personal gym like a lot of these guys have, maybe in Florida. Knowing this indefinite period of who knows when we're gonna be coming back, it's at least gonna be a month and a half from now, so I gotta just relax. I gotta enjoy this time. Get my body healthy. We were finding work out programs that Leo has sent me, you guys have sent me to just do at home. Whether it's with weights or with no weights. It's to keep the body active and to have something like that, have a program, keeps me motivated. Keeps me from doing something that rather than just sleeping in until 3pm, waking up, eating a meal, then going back to sleep. Keeps me active. Keeps me doing something. I bought myself a PS4, like you said, keeps me able to connect with friends, have a little fun. And knowing that we have a month and a half off, at least half of the time, it's gonna be hard to, this first half is gonna be hard to motivate yourself to go out there and practice because you want to be safe. You want to do your part in the community to stay away from people. So it's not like I can go out to the golf course every single day, start grinding, start playing my matches, start figuring everything out. I might go here and there, since I do have the availability of having a golf course open and just stay loose. But when we do find out when things are getting a little better and we have a date that we're able to come back, I think that's when Rick and I are really going to sit down and talk again. How are we going to get our game back to where we were at the Players, not how are we gonna get our game back to when we have taken this, who knows, two month, three month break, and slowly get in the rhythm of things? Cause when things do start up, everyone is gonna play. Everyone is gonna want to play. And you want to have that edge against everyone, even though we all took a few months off, you want to be ready the first day when everything starts.

Leo
I have one last question. So it sounds like you have prepared from eight years old, all the way to the PGA TOUR, in the absolute perfect way. Simulating how you were gonna warm up, and things like that in college. What is the most surprising thing? Is there anything that weren't as you expected when you went on tour? Is there one thing that stands out? Or was it just perfect?

Mac
Just all went according to plan.

Collin
Actually I don't wish that there were more surprising things, but I think Rick and I have done a lot of research on what we needed to do, and I think that's what made this transition a lot easier. I'm going from the amateur and college tournaments and ranks, to going straight to the PGA TOUR. We knew what we had to do. My golf game was definitely good enough to come out here. With limited starts, it's obviously very tough. What we did over this past summer, the three of us, we made a name for ourselves. We were able to do it in these seven or so starts. But whether it happened this summer or not, I still felt like my golf game was there. Even if I spent a year on the Korn Ferry tour, it still would have been a nice path because we would have gotten something out of the summer. And for us, it's always learning. It's always learning what we're going to do better, what we've learned on what we haven't done well, and using that to the future. So I think, for the PGA Tour and throughout, from when I started playing a bunch of tournaments when I was eight, up until now, is that we've always prepped ourselves well for what was to come. It's not like these tours we're playing are longer, really long golf courses. It's not like we went from college of playing 7,000 yard golf courses, on the PGA Tour playing 8,000 yard golf courses. There's nothing different. We're still playing a golf course. We're playing a lot nicer golf courses or playing golf courses that have a bigger name for themselves. That does not mean my golf game needs to change and I think we've done our research on how to bring everything to the next level, but still be myself. Be who I am. The goal for any of them out there and just bring what I have to the table out on the PGA Tour.

Leo
Maybe the biggest surprise was it was so easy for you to win.

Collin
No, not at all. I think if we're talking about surprises, what surprised me the most was literally just how I was gonna manage my time. As juniors, the people that want to become a PGA Tour player, they think all of us are out there grinding 24/7 and there's no let up. That's what I thought, I thought everyone, when I was a junior, I thought all these PGA TOUR pros are using all these devices, doing everything, adding everything in. But it's not the case. I'll say it for myself, and I'll back myself up on this. If juniors wanna ask me, is that I don't think I need to be out there 24/7. That's just not who I am. And yes, we do have everything available to us at our fingertips if you need, and that's what's amazing. That's what makes the PGA TOUR so fun, is that if we do need something, if we do need help, Rick knows a bunch of people. The PGA TOUR has a bunch of people that I can reach out to if I do need something. But it does not mean you have to take everything that everyone has available to you and just start using it at your expense. It's just something you gotta realize. What kind of player are you? If you gotta practice, you gotta practice. If it's not, go out there and have fun when you're not on the golf course.

Mac
I thought the biggest surprise was Matt Wolf hitting that putt in, from against the collar there. That's pretty surprising.

Collin
I had to figure he was gonna make it, one of us was gonna make it. Hopefully, it would have been both, but you know, it's all in the past.

Leo
I was so impressed by how you handled that. Most people coming from college, playing against your college buddy, and losing against them like that. You just handled it like a champion. I mean, it was really impressive because I think most rookies would have been pretty sour and bitter.

Collin
It was tough. Obviously I wanted to win. One of us was gonna win. One of us was gonna lose. That's the
way competition works. I'm happy that he won, I'm happy it was one of us that won. It could have been a bunch of people I know throughout the day that had a chance to win. But at that point, I was playing really good golf. If I had finished solo second, I would have guaranteed my PGA TOUR card for the next year. I had a three more events to earn so many points, which is pretty much making the cut, finishing top 30. But I wasn't even focused on that. I had another week right after, I had John Deere the next week. We had a shuttle bus that drove us down, me and my girlfriend, and it was it was one of the toughest Mondays, for sure, because I was dead. That final round really took it out of me, but I knew I was playing really good golf. I had prepped for John Deere and I thought I could win. It went from winning that Sunday to ok, finished second. I had a lot of points on my FedEx Cup list to possibly earn my PGA TOUR card. I was guaranteed for Korn Ferry finals, but it was aside the fact. Let's earn enough points to get my PGA TOUR card to let's go win. When I got a fourth place finish there, earned enough points to get my card for this season, I literally only had two more starts to continue my season and be a winner. It was win or nothing. And I think that's the difference of those two tournaments that have brought a different feeling. Because win or nothing is like when you're playing as an amateur, you're playing on a sponsor's exemption. There's nothing to lose. And I think that's the mindset that I gotta bring out here. These are all opportunities for me, and I'm trying to win. If I don't win, whatever. Let's go into the next week, figure something out and try one again.

Leo
Amazing. Well thank you so much guys. Really learned a lot. Just really grateful to have you guys here. And don't change anything. That is what I would say. And if anybody's out there that wants to learn from Rick, this is the perfect time to do a video session with Rick, one of the best coaches around. Thank you again, and good luck. We'll probably talk soon.

Mac
Thank you both.

Rick
I appreciate that. Can I say one last thing?

Leo
Of course.

Rick
Thank you, Mac. Thank you, Leo. For UGP. You guys have given me a platform, obviously. And you've helped Collin out tremendously, helped one of my clients out, and I love the mission, and I love the team environment you provide. I'm trying to create a team for Collin and other students, and you guys provide that already at your facility. So thank you for what you guys are doing.

Collin
Yeah. Thank you, guys. You guys have changed everything. Talked about routines and everything, what I do daily. You guys have added that. Appreciate you for everything.

Mac
You guys are awesome and enjoy the best you can.

Leo
Stay safe, and we'll talk soon.